Renacor of #rubyonrails is a twonk!

Argued that putting validation messages in the model breaks MVC and that they should be put in the view because they're display logic.

After he got banned from #rubyonrails, this discussion took place.

<Renacor> that was kind of childish don't you think?

<Radar> Yes, on your behalf for sure. Goodbye.

<Renacor> I guess you guys just want people to idle in there instead of discuss issues like this

<Renacor> your loss

<Radar> Do not argue with the people who know better and are trying to help you, it will get you nowhere.

<Radar> Go discuss it on the google groups.

<Renacor> ahh see there's your first mistake

<Renacor> don't assume that you always know better

<Radar> How many years rails experience do you have?

<Renacor> a good programmer should always be open to other perspectives especially if he can't prove them wrong

<Renacor> just a couple of weeks maybe

<Radar> If you set the validation error messages in the fucking view they are not available in the controller.

<Renacor> I have several years of programming experience however

<Radar> I have 2 years experience. I would know better.

<Renacor> I don't care about validation messages in the controller

<Renacor> umm MVC is not a ruby thing <Radar>

<Radar> Rails is highly-opinionated. There are certain ways to do things. I already told you to take it up on the mailing list (where much smarter people debate much smarter issues) and then you'll see.

<Renacor> contrary to what you might have been lead to believe

<Renacor> well getting kicked from a channel without even debunking my view on this is kinda silly i think

<Radar> Your view was debunked by withanx!

<Renacor> I mean I wasn't even being offensive or anything

<Renacor> not really

<Radar> Setting the messages in the view will make them inaccessible in the controller.

<Radar> I don't care if you don't care about the controller, other people would like them in there.

12:34 <Renacor> how was it debunked, it is very clear the V in MVC stands for view, display type things and minimal logic, setting display text inside the M ("model") does NOT follow the MVC pattern

<Radar> Ugh.

<Renacor> and you can still know what kind of error you had inside the controller

<Renacor> via an error code

<Radar> Error codes that would have to be interpreted, go back to php land.

<Renacor> I mean, do you honestly check for what kind of an error you had via checking the error message???

<Renacor> thats not php land my friend, it's programming land

<Renacor> we don't use string comparisons in conditionals, that is very very bad practice

<Renacor> and what you are proposing is exactly that

<Radar> We don't need to check! We simply do if @blog.save...

<Renacor> but suit yourself

<Radar> if that returns false, then we KNOW we have errors

<Radar> And usually it's sensical field names like title, which are then displayed with error_messages_for

<Renacor> If I write something that returns errors, I don't write it to return the text of those errors if it's a model, I write it to return a status

<Renacor> then in the view I will evaluate the status and display the proper text

<Renacor> which presents a problem in my case perfectly

<Radar> Right, if you want to do that you can use the validate method.

<Renacor> since now that I am trying to localize this text that is coming from the model instead of the view I am veering away from the MVC pattern

<Radar> heh, localizations

<Renacor>internationalize/localize

<Radar>You were already given an option, surely you know how localization works in Rails 2.2

<Renacor> negative we implemented our own localization, and I believe we are on 1.8

<Radar> That's Ruby.

<Renacor> I am not a big ruby fan to be honest, but this kinda turned me off even more

<Renacor> not so much that this one function doesn't really follow the MVC design pattern

<Renacor> but that you would get kicked out of a room for discussing a valid point

<Radar> Take it up on the core mailing list. You will get responses from people who have worked on Rails for a very long time.

<Renacor> I thought kicks were reserved to more severe issues, not to actually censor people who have valid issues

<Radar> Ha. valid issues.

<Renacor> I understand that and it's a good point, but again you guys haven't proved why it doesn't break the MVC pattern

<Radar> You were being a pest! Last chance. Take it up on the core mailing list or I'll re-implement your ban for #rubyonrails and it will be permanent.

<Renacor> dude go for it if you really feel like it, and I will post it on lots of blogs to show people how you guys treat people in that channel

<Radar> rofl

<Radar> I'm sure you're Mr. Popular.

<Renacor> I don't think this is the right way to promote your cause, but oh well

<Radar> Take it up on the goddamned mailing list. That's all I have to say.

<Renacor> Sarcasm in a situation like this when I am being serious is the hallmark of childishness

<Renacor> k

<Renacor> bye

f yah he is